Il Gruppo Progetto: Serotta Colorado AL
The Velominatus’ machine is their own manifestation of personal taste and demonstration of adherence to The Rules. We each, in our own way, meticulously maintain our bicycles and adorn them with the essential, yet minimal, accoutrement. Yes, we must Obey the Rules pertaining to bar tape, tyre selection, saddle choice, stem height, color matching and so on. But within those parameters there lies flexibility and choice.
Furthermore, this site is a refuge we turn to for brotherhood, community, and belonging. However, cyberspace is a vacuum in that we apply and practice our craft apart from one another, spread to all corners of the globe. With this in mind, I offer an experiment, Il Gruppo Progetto, inspired by Brett’s Il Progetto: Bosomworth. The intent, dare I say charge, of Il Gruppo Progetto, is for our community of Velominati to come together in designing my new build project, a Serotta Colorado AL.
I picked up the Serotta frame and fork recently to further my adherence, em, obsession over Rule #12. Although not a top shelf Serotta (think of it as Maker’s Mark as opposed to The Glenlivet), it is a platform worthy of respect, care, and craftsmanship. As fall arrived I found my foul weather steed in need of replacement and the Serotta was the perfect combination of material, style, and economics. My mind was flooded with ideas of how I might build her up. Then I thought of all of you, your experience, ideas, and of course, passion.
So as fellow Velominati, I humbly ask of your counsel for this build. The basic platform is as follows:
- Serotta Colorado AL frame and Kinesis aluminum fork
- Shimano Ultegra 6600 and 6500 mixed group set (6500 cranks – octolink) 10 sp
- Shimano SPD SL pedals
- Bontrager XXX Lite wheelset
As you can see from the list above this worthy steed is in need of much more. Bars, stem, bar tape, saddle, seat post, possibly a fork, tires, chain, headset, and cables. Please keep in mind the following:
- I do have budget constraints.
- This bike should be capable of riding many miles on gravel as well as tarmac.
- My plan is for this bike to be utilitarian in nature. Performance, knock-about, foul weather, durability, weight, aesthetics, tradition, period (mid 90’s to 2004 or so)
So there you have it. My proposition is for us to come together in a modicum of further connection than what cyberspace allows. My hope is that the finished build will be a tangible symbol of our collective wisdom and a reminder to me of what we, the Velominati represent, as I ride this bike.
Thanks in advance for playing.
Bontrager = Antichrist
@Cyclops
That may be my friend but they’re what I’ve got laying around and must get used. And to play devil’s advocate, those XXX lite wheels are seven years old, have thousands of miles on them and have never needed a thing. That said, I like them. So, explain to me your objection.
A beautiful frame for a rain bike. My vote is to keep the fork. I think the chrome will look best with the rest of the paint scheme.
Chain – SRAM with the Powerlink so it’s easy to get off and clean.
Bartape – there must be some to match the frame colour.
Wheels – I have to agree with Cyclops. I’d be inclined to flog them and put the money towards some more acceptable wheels. Some second hand Mavics perhaps.
Pedals – good for crappy conditions, or at least the cleats are tough. You might need to get them polished to bare metal to match the chrome / cover scrapes?
Tyres – GP 4 season – 28s?
I’m struggling to think that the type of cable really matters. Evidently, I’ll never make a good Velominatus
@Marko “No Bontrager wheelset is worth its weight in dogshit”. (Quote: user review on Roadbikereview.com
URGENT DISCLAIMER: Before I get shredded by loyal Bontrager customers, I haven’t tried them myself. They might be wonderful.
I didn’t really like the look of them and I’ve instinctively avoided anything Pharmstrong might have used.
@George
Bontrager input heard. Like I said, I’ve got em and I’m gonna use them as I’ve been happy with them and am not gonna dump scrill into wheels right now. It is, after all, a rain bike. At some point I’ll swap them out for something else but for now they stay.
I’m liking the chain suggestion. The pedals are brushed alu so that’s not a factor as they’ll match quite well (a solid pedal which I also dig)
The GP 4 season is gonna be hard to beat, we’ll see if anyone else has an opinion. 28’s seem burly enough but are they too burly?
I do have some Gore Ride-on cable housing that came with my Red gruppo for bike #1. I’m running Yokozuna on that but had to hygrate the cable inards for something else but I do have the housing. The Ride-on may be just the ticket for this build.
Thanks for the input, keep it coming
@Marko
Just personal prejudice based on nothing more than atoms colliding in my dolby. I am (typically) inconsistent in my biases but that’s what makes me so cool. However, the flow chart of reason might look something like this:
Trek Bicycles tries to sue Winery named Trek – Trek Bicycles sucks
Lance Sucks – Lance rides a Trek – Trek Bicycles sucks
Kiyomi Waller (former Trek BMX AA Pro) stiffs me by not showing up to a race that I was promoting – Trek Bicycles sucks
Keith Bontrager thinks his shit don’t stink
Bontrager sells out to Trek – (remember) Trek Bicycles sucks
Bontrager = Trek – Trek Bicycles sucks
Conclusion: While your wheels (sans Bontrager labeling) might be perfectly serviceable and even better than most – they suck*,**.
*Ben Serotta is too cool and old school to have one of his products tainted by installing corporate money fodder, juiceinator, China hoops on it.
**Please keep in mind that I think Cannondales suck too and yet I ride a Cannondale so you can pretty much ignore anything that I say.
@Cyclops
Could you elaborate on your disdain for Bontrager. I am not a Bontrager fanboy or even own a single Bontrager item, but would love to hear your reasoning. I also remember seeing a venomous post of yours regarding Pearl Izumi within the depths of this site, and am curious on your position there as well.
@Marko
KoolStop brake pads.
I’m starting mine with an old Raleigh steel frame (no fork) converted to single speed. It will be an extreme budget project. I might do some photos as I go.
@Cyclops
Fair enough. I will take your suggestion of removing the decals. Let’s move on.
@George
I like it. Please do. I will need new pads for this build and the koolstops are bomber in the rain, eh?
@Marko
I use Koolstops for all my brake pads. They’re much better than the standard Shimanos and still a half way reasonable price. I switched after the first century / 3 day stage race I ever did on a road bike. It was very Rule #9 with extra 5 & 10 for good measure – not that I knew anything about Rules then. Destroyed a set of shimano pads in one particularly wet day.
While not built of GLORIOUS STEEL, the polished fork/stays as well as the Ultegra components demand you use polished silver bar, stem and seat post as well. If the Bontrager wheels are black, they must not be used.
Don’t take me seriously dude. In reality I truly think bagging on people’s tastes in anything such as music, bikes, cars, etc. is pretty immature and just our way of making ourselves feel better about ourselves – I was a 40 year old with no car, living with me mum, and racing a BMX bike and still listening to Slayer so that demonstrates my maturity level. But I’m all about humor at the expense of others so there you go.
As far as Pearl Izumi goes – this is another example of my blind hypocracy – after purchasing a nice set of Assos bibs I have come to loathe PI yet I still run their gloves and tights so, once again, “you can pretty much ignore anything that I say.”
@Rusty Tool Shed
Good suggestions on the polished bars and stem. The thought crossed my mind as well. However, there are no Rules stipulating that wheel material must match gruppo, stem, and bar material.
This stem actually piqued my attention:
and I was sort of thinking polished Chris King headset. But I could go yellow or black.
keep em coming
It appears to be a threaded fork so the use of that stem would require the use of an adaptor. Surely that would NOT be acceptable.
@Rusty Tool Shed
agreed. there is an issue there.
?????
Thumbs up!
@Rusty Tool Shed
silver enough?
Dammit, Marko… I was about to say Chris King headset… a) a Serotta frame deserves one, even if a distillery blend; b) they are bombproof and low maintenance… ideal for a winter bike and c) they come in cooool colours. Downside: the price.
My heart sank when I saw you are using Shimano on drive train… It’s a winter bike… What do the Japanese know about Rule #9?… contrast that with the Glory (and Snow) of many a Giro…
I’m loving Rusty Tool Shed’s use of both capitals and adjectives with ‘GLORIOUS STEEL’
@roadslave
I hear ya on the Shimano too roadslave but it’s what I got. Again though, the shit is bomber IMHO. And I aint buying a new gruppo for this bike.
It does deserve a King, put it on, looks good, works extremely well, forget about it.
Cool project! I’m currently collecting parts for a Colorado II build myself. 3ttt did make a quill version of the Mutant stem, but it’s rare to find one these days. Their Mutant handlebar has a nice shape, too, with indentations for your thumbs. Also, IMHO a IRD Techno-Glide sealed cartridge headset is a much better value than a Chris King.
@James
I’ll look into the IRD, thanks for the suggestion as I’m not familiar.
Hmmm, look sweet. What color?
@George
There’s your mistake; you’re not supposed to use your brakes.
Tires– you might be able to find a good deal on last year’s Vittoria Open Paves (the 290 tpi version). Bombproof yet with a beautiful ride. Just ordered a pair for my rain bike. I have to think the green version is an acceptable deviation from Rule #8 as they are iconic symbols of Rules #5 and #9.
@George
Agreed on the Kool Stops. The salmon pads are amazing in the rain.
@Rusty Tool Shed
Ha, funny you mention this; I recently started riding my other bikes again and not riding just the R3 since the weather is starting to turn. It’s made me realize that the position on those bikes isn’t quite right and I needed more setback on the saddle. As a tester before investing in a new post, I chucked my old Ritchey post from my Bridgestone MB-0 on there and I have to say, I am DIGGIN’ on the alu look.
Nice frame to start with. Yeah, hopefully you’ll just use a quill stem. I think they are perfect for a bad weather bike.
What type of shoes are you planning on using with those pedals? Road? Mtn?
I actually just demoted my first true road bike to my bad weather bike. It never really fit me that well, but I have too many miles on it to ditch it. It’s an Al Cannondale circa 1998. It’s in fine working condition and I’m excited to finally have a bike I don’t mind getting wet and grimy. I’d do it to my other bikes, but then would spend an hour or two cleaning them after every ride. That gets old.
Just put some fenders on mine and installed tail light mounts. Bring the winter weather on!
@Cyclops
Nicely put. I too enjoy a little humour at someone else’s expense. Especially at Heuvos’ and Bertie’s expense.
While I’m with you on not purposely buying Bontrager, Trek, or Pearl products, I certainly can’t argue with Marko’s experience. A rain bike is all about the reliability and bomber-ness of the components. I believe he’s even ridden those wheels on his ‘cross bike, so I am firmly in his camp to suggest he keep ’em.
frank…I’m sure we’ve gone over this, but how darn tall are you? Your post on the Bianchi might be longer than my ST.
Cycling is the first sport I’ve ever participated in where I’m quite happy to not be that big and don’t find myself wishing I was taller. Yeehaw, I love watching the Clydes carry around all that mass!
@Marko
No anodized parts, even from King. I’d say silver. Not a huge fan of the mutant stem; although for silver your options might be limited. You could also rock out the ITM Big One in yellow. Channel a little Pantani while you’re at it.
@roadslave
There are a handful of items in the queue to go into the Lexi; this one has been added.
@Nate
Oooooh, I would definitely agree.
On to my suggestions:
Rain bikes require a few key items: sealed headset, sealed BB, sealed hubs on the wheels.
Given the dirt-road factor, I would point you to 25mm tires, I think, although you can try 28. They might be too much on the tarmac, though. 25 should be a good balance. I prefer Conti GP4000’s for all conditions, bomb-proof. I think they make a 25, but I’m not sure.
As for the stem, the Cinelli XA stems were the bomb, plus you could add the little strip of colored rubber to make a nice, subtle connection to the frame.
I would go with Fi’zi’k microtext bar wrap; probably lean towards silver, with a silver saddle, too – like on my Bianchi. It’s a slick look, and the stuff does not wear at all; never gets dirty.
If you decide to bail on the Ride-On cables, consider scoring some yellow standard housing; you can make the decals pop nicely using that old 7-Eleven cablin’ trick.
You gotta swap the fork, I think… I wouldn’t ride a alloy fork given the superior ride of a steel or carbon fork which are far springier and damp, the weight savings necessity of the time they were produced isn’t longer relevant.
DA7410 w/ 9 speed? Lovely, cheap kit it is. Personal Rule is black cables unless current ano grey color is on whatever kit is current, whereas grey will be allowed if it is more ubiquitous/available.
@Colin
Hadn’t thought of a steel fork, not a bad suggestion. Carbon of course came to mind but I may build it up with the current fork to save cash and switch later. I’ll prolly rattle a few fillings loose in the process.
@frank
based on suggestions thus far I’m thinking anodized is most certainly out. Even the yellow Pantani ITM. Bringing out the “chrome” will pop.
@Ron
these are the pedals I’m using for this bike
shoes will be a retired pair (on a comeback tour, think Cipo not LA) of Frank’s DMT ultimax.
@Nate
That’s tits. Now I have at least two sweet tyre choices. I love that suggestion, those greenies are buttery.
@Colin, @Marko
The corralary to the “sealed sealed sealed” principle of rain bikes it the “corrosion corrosion corrosion” effect. As good as the ride is, steel anything is a bad idea for a rain bike. Ti, Carbon or Alu are where it’s at.
Jesus, what am I hearing here? Green tyres, yellow cables, silver tape and saddle? It’s a fucking RAIN BIKE isn’t it? Not a frickin Xmas tree. BLACK. All around. No further questions, Your Honour.
And GP4000s are a race tyre; one that is not “bombproof”, unless the bombs you refer to are thorns, then even those will cut the casing just by being in the vicinity of the tyre. They suck. Get UltraSports or DuraSkins in 25s if you go the Conti route, or Schwalbe Duranos if you really want bombproof.
Wheels: while I know you have them ‘lying around’, I’m with Cyclops on nixxing the Bontragers (not least because Lance sucks). A rain bike needs box section rims, 32h 3x. Shit, every bike needs that! (My retro fetish is getting well out of hand…)
Frank, your Bianchi makes me Hard As Steel, whereas your Cervelo makes me physically ill. You know what to do.
@Brett
Believe me, the box is on my brain. In due time my brotha. And I will not due yellow cables and I will not due silver bar tape. i’m leaning toward black still
I think I found my stem?
@Marko
Nice, on both counts.
@all
Observation, while a wrap of 3M tape around the seatpost to indicate saddle height is perfectly acceptable on a carbon post, it is very unsightly on an alloy post. One is expected to cut a small sliver of tape to serve this purpose, but to minimize the reduction of it’s Alloy Glory.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
@frank
Another sano method is a rubber O-ring. It easily adjust to “Merckxish” adjustments made on the fly too.
Not directly on point, but a bit relevant to the Trek / Cannonwhale / Bonty hatemail: Spent two weeks in Chianti recently, enjoying pasta and vino rosso but badly missing cycling. (Suggestion from She Who Must Be Obeyed that I buy a nice Italian steed while there was nixed on the basis that I can’t afford it – particularly if, as I suspect, she would see it as justification for equal expenditure at Prada). So, naturally, I kept a keen eye out for fellow cyclists – anticipating at least some regular vicarious enjoyment of Italian frames and kit. There is very little about Chianti which could ever disappoint me – but this was one of them. Saw quite a few Bianchis – though more often thaan not they were not high-specc’d and were being ridden by guided tours whose participants were often quite a lot more than two months from peaking. Saw quite a few older steel and alloy bikes ridden by the locals – generally well maintained, and being ridden by people in nice kit. But did not see many high-end Colnagos, Pinarellos, etc. Rather, I saw a vast number of … Treks and Cannondales. Ridden by Italians. I had been prepared to see Toyotas almost outnumber Fiats and Alfas. But I had not been prepared for the preponderance of American brands in preference to the local offerings. Can’t attest to the prevalence or otherwise of Bontragers. But I have my suspicions.
If you want to go a little left field, convert the rims to tubeless, Stan’s sealant and Hutchinson intensive 25s. You should NEVER flat. And if the frame doesn’t have one already drill a little hole underneath the bottom bracket so water can run out – imperative for a long lasting steel rain bike. And steel is cool for a rain bike just like it is cool for any bike!
Alright, I’m going with the Cinelli 101 stem (first quill stem pic’d) and taking James’ suggestion on the IRD headset. Drop the wheel issue guys, it’s not happening right now. Any suggestions on bars (44’s), bar tape? I’m thinking another Antares to keep my boys playing in the same neighborhood as my #1 bike (and asking cyclops to embroider a V-cog on it if he can forgive my bontragers)
That Cinelli 101 stem is definitely sweet. I believe it comes in either a 26.0 or 26.4mm clamp diameter, but only Cinelli makes 26.4mm bars. If you want to score massive obscure kit points, find Cinelli EXA hexagonal dropbars from the 80’s. ;)
@Marko
Been a productive day at the office, hmm?
@Colin
Oh boy. Now we will be confusing the hell out of everybody. It was bound to happen that a one-eller would join the group. Welcome.
@George…. I hear you brother. It brings us back to that age old conundrum: what the fuck have the italians ever done for road cycling? they don’t even appreciate the beauty of their own homegrown equipment. But Chianti…. Barolo… Brunello di Montalcino… it’s like drinking liquid silk… and you need a stopwatch to measure the finish. V jealous of your trip, but understand: She Who Must Be Obeyed must be obeyed, particularly on vacation.
We have a new concept in our house (built off back of Commonwealth Games) of earned rides… not ‘medals’, but ‘pedals’: Gold Pedals = 75km – 100km; Silver Pedal = 50m – 75km and a Bronze Pedal = <50km. Pedals earned for good parenting or housekeeping. I'm currently under negotiations for a 'Titanium Pedal' (100km – 150km) and a 'Weapons-grade plutonium pedal' (Free pass to go out and bury it on the bike for as long as I damn well can).
@G’phant
I wonder what influence Liquigas has on the Cannondale appeal in Italia. I ride a CAAD9, and love it, so I don’t know what all the fuss is about.
@roadslave
As clever and elaborate as all this seems, it sounds as though it’s in violation of Rule #11.
@Steampunk
midterms. easy. i give exams and take them home at night to grade.