That is the question. Are carbon wheels a viable option for everyday riding? Should carbon wheels be your go-to wheels rather than your just-for-racing wheels? I don’t really race and I don’t own any carbon wheels and I wonder. Granted, every professional is and has been on carbon wheels for many years so it’s easy to think we should be on them too. Brett’s review of ENVE wheels certainly made a case for them, who dosen’t want to go faster, all the time? Frank has raved about how fast his Zipp 303s are since he first put them on his Cervelo. I hefted his Café Roubaix Haleakala climbing wheels and one dosen’t need to heft them as much as hold them down, they are unbelievably light, sub-1000 grams light.
Those wheels are too light for the rigors of the East Maui Loop pavé and potholes, or so I thought. I talked Frank out of using them and he did the Cogal on Zipp 404s and 25mm clinchers. In retrospect, with bigger tires I think he would have been OK doing the Cogal on his climbing wheels. If ultralight carbon wheels are tough enough for that ride then when are they inappropriate? Ambrosio golden ticket aluminum box section rims versus Zipp 303s, let’s see, Boonen just won Paris-Roubaix on the Zipp 404s. That is the end of the discussion. It should be the beginning of the end for three-cross box section aluminum wheels. If Zipp 303s win Paris-Roubaix then when wouldn’t one use carbon wheels?
@chiasticon-
Surprised to see so much talk of carbon wheels for a Cogal; which is, essentially, not much different than a club run. I understand Frank wanting to run them for his climb up Haleakala, since he was going for a PR up a huge friggin’ volcano and I’m sure they certainly helped. But as an every day wheel for a club/social/training ride? At least within the circles I ride in, that’s a good reason to get laughed off the ride (comments would especially come from the local racers). It’s like saying “I can’t keep up with you guys without these wheels!” Or at least that’s how people generally take it.
…but how common is it among Velominati to use carbon wheels on an everyday basis?
On the Cogal ride, out of seven riders there were two people on carbon wheels. On our Sunday club ride there is maybe one user. I see a lot of bikes on the site with drool-worthy carbon wheels. Are aluminum rims old school? Are we being played here or are we all just a little behind the times or are we saving our money for better bike investments?
Strong, light, cheap. Pick two – I’m going to attribute this to Keith Bontrager as it was etched on my Bontrager’s stem cap. I’d like to add a fourth adjective, aerodynamic, but my tiny brain can’t compute how picking two or three might work so cleverly.
Strong
There are not many high end frames made from aluminum anymore. Could the same case be made for wheels? The aluminum box rim may be light but it is not strong unless you lace a lot of crossed spokes on it. I have some 80s Campagnolo Vento deep wheels, aero maybe, not light and the ride is a bit harsh. An unlaced carbon rim may not be lighter than a light weight aluminum rim but it is much stronger.
Light
I’m afraid carbon is going to win here. While a case could have been made for the Ambrosio golden ticket being strong, it is not light. There are some semi-aero aluminum wheels out there that are light but they make me nervous with their low weight limit.
Cheap
Boing! There it is. Strong and cheap is aluminum’s territory. One pays $1100US more for Easton’s Carbon EC90 SLX wheels than the aluminum EA 90 SLX wheelset. 200 grams is the only difference between the two models. If that was the end of the comparisons I wouldn’t lose any sleep over my lack of carbone wheels but there is still one other factor.
Aerodynamic
Carbon wins this easily. The carbon can be a fairing or integral to the wheel’s strength but carbon’s moldability is the future. Formula 1 cars are no longer made of aluminum. Boonen must have saved significant energy on the long paved run-in to the pavé sectors using his Zipps, maybe enough energy to help burn everyone off his wheel later on. @Tommy Tubulare’s Cervelo with Campagnolo Bora deep carbon wheels makes my heart skip a beat. Carbon wheels look badass.
Conclusion
Once again I have no informed opinion having never ridden carbon wheels. Would I love to see my bike looking extremely pro with some deep section carbon wheels? Yes. Would it be very bad to be shelled out the back end of a group ride while riding said wheels? Yes, it would be very bad.
Should my wheels be worth more than the rest of the bike? Who cares. Let’s address @chiasticon’s question, who’s riding carbon and when?
[dmalbum path=”/velominati.com/content/Photo Galleries/j.andrews3@comcast.net/carbone wheels/”/]
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@Mark1
Maybe I'm not understanding your point, but I thought this had been debunked. I don't think that at speed a wheel requires any effort to maintain its rotation. This is evidenced by:
@Isaac Newton
Once the wheel is at speed it should be friction (road and bearings) slowing it down. Nothing more. Aerodynamics notwithstanding.
Wheel weight is a concern for climbing and for spinning up, and I suppose the weight plays into rolling resistance, but when you are talking about 200g on a 65kg object, it should be a non factor.
Of course I could be completely wrong.
Once you tried the light weight and great looks of the carbon clinchers you don't want to go back tot aluminum. I've got the Hyperon's from Campa (oh yeah the top ones) and they're great on the flat and hills. Don't like to bring them to the cobbles though.....
@Sluggo
The R3's the Pros race are famously adapted for this; longer stays and more clearance.
That said, there is no way you're getting 28's in your R3, but if you aren't getting 25's in your R3, you're doing something wrong. I had the same problem until I replaced my fork (the Alpha Q GS40 didn't have the clearance) and of the two R3's and one Soloist in the household, all rear triangles happily take a 25 without modification.
@G'Rilla's newer R3 took them without complaint as well.
@sidi3058
Agreed - the key is how light the rim is; after riding carbon tubs (Haleakalas and the CX wheels from Café Roubaix), I truly don't want to ride my 404 clichers any more - the rim weight is very noticeable once you've been let into the dark room.
@frank subtle bit of advertising for KT13 there!
I've got to run and I'm sure lots of people have said lots of smart things which I hope to catch up on later this week, but in response to @chiasticon's remark in the post -
Maybe its because once I've put an idea through my own brain's value metrix, I don't feel compelled to put it through someone else's, but this reasoning about getting laughed out of the group is one of those things where Roadies genuinely deserve the reputation for being snobby douchebags.
Ride what you got, ride what you want - why is there some arbitrary wheel that deserves to be ridden on any given day? I ride for pleasure - even when I race - and I conduct myself as such. I'll ride the wheels that are fun on the day whether that's on box clinchers, box tubs, deep dish clinchers, or deep dish tubs and that should be that. N+1 applies to wheels as well, by the way.
On the other hand, I'd suggest that if money is an issue and they can only own one set of wheels that it should be a racing wheel, not a training wheel, especially if they intend on racing.
@frank Yes the difference is amazing. For anyone looking for an upgrade for their bike, i'd say invest in lighter wheels. And in new shoes, socks and rim tape every now and then.
Let's say a feller has only ever ridden on Al clinchers. Should he venture first into tubular Al wheels or just go all in a take aim at Carbone tubulars?
And for those of you doing a lot of your riding on carbon tubulars, do you always carry & spare & swap it on the road or do you just always carry your phone for the VMH Sag Wagon? (I know this is in the Rules, but thought I'd ask, since we're askin' questions.)
I'm a LOOOOONNNG way from the point where the weight/aerodynamic advantages of carbon wheels would make any difference whatsoever, so I've always been in the cheap and strong camp.
I'm currently going into my third year on a set of Vuelta Corsa Lites, and for $250/set, they have performed ridiculously well. True as the day I got them, and they still spin forever. They are handbuilt and lighter than many lower-end carbon wheels out there at about 1350 grams. I was expecting to have them for a year and then go on to other more expensive wheels, but they've given me no reason to change them out. Truly one of the best "diamond in the rough" velo-deals I've been lucky enough to find.
Of course, now that I've gone on the record praising them, they'll probably explode in a blaze of glory on my next ride...
@frank
Riding on a non race day on anything that is Carbone is a sin! To have such light spinny stuff under you on a training ride is heresy and should not be entertained, it means you are no longer fighting a gorilla but something more akin to a Capuchin or Marmoset and this is cheating! The heavier, more resistant wheels and tyres you run, the harder you are training! Forget rule 9 being about riding in bad weather...it should be about the desire to ride cast iron squares!!
I say this not out of wisdom, technical knowledge, or reasoned decision but simply because I cannot afford a pair of Carbones and therefore they are to be ignored or denegrated at every opportunity.
As soon as I am light enough and rich enough to get some they will obviously become worthing riding at every available opportunity.....cue semi colon, close brackets!