Categories: The BikesThe RidesTraditionUnforgettable Rides

Weight Weenies

Parting the waters on a 24 pound bike.

My bike weighs about 6 kilos. It is no waify little thing either, with it having a 61cm frame and and three stories of seatpost. It has beefy tubes, a stiff bottom bracket and steerer, and deep section wheels which are laced 3x in the back and 2x in front. This bike has never made me go faster; only going faster has made me go faster.

Gianni rode Haleakala in the 80’s on a heavy steel frame with a 42T chainring and a 23T cog in the back. He rode it wearing a cuttoff sleeveless t-shirt; an offense which, had I known when we started this site, I would have put him on probation for. Then he did it again several years later on a titanium, campa-equipped steed with a compact and wearing proper kit. He rode it in about the same time, also proving that you go as fast as you want, not as fast as your bike is.

Gianni Bugno (different Gianni but possibly the source of inspiration for Keeper Gianni’s name), won back-to-back l’Alpe d’Huez stages on a 24-pound steel Moser, beating lighter carbon TVT’s to the punch both times.

Riding light bikes is fun, but they won’t make you go any faster. Pushing harder on the pedals does.

frank

The founder of Velominati and curator of The Rules, Frank was born in the Dutch colonies of Minnesota. His boundless physical talents are carefully canceled out by his equally boundless enthusiasm for drinking. Coffee, beer, wine, if it’s in a container, he will enjoy it, a lot of it. He currently lives in Seattle. He loves riding in the rain and scheduling visits with the Man with the Hammer just to be reminded of the privilege it is to feel completely depleted. He holds down a technology job the description of which no-one really understands and his interests outside of Cycling and drinking are Cycling and drinking. As devoted aesthete, the only thing more important to him than riding a bike well is looking good doing it. Frank is co-author along with the other Keepers of the Cog of the popular book, The Rules, The Way of the Cycling Disciple and also writes a monthly column for the magazine, Cyclist. He is also currently working on the first follow-up to The Rules, tentatively entitled The Hardmen. Email him directly at rouleur@velominati.com.

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frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 9:30 am

@Teocalli

@frank

@Owen

@Teocalli

I have definitely crushed at least one Strava segment in the area on the commuter simply because it’s so godawful rough that no one wants to risk their carbon steeds by hitting the stretch hard. I certainly don’t since if I break my bike I’m just out of luck. Aluminum is definitely more jarring but the giant tires make up for it.

Having ridden the Carrefour and Arenberg and the rest of Roubaix and Flanders on my above-mentioned carbon steed, I call bullshit.

That said, lightweight does no good on the flat.

Well I’ve ridden Carrefour and sections around there on carbon this year. Near shook my fillings out. I can’t help but wonder whether there would be a difference on steel. I suspect the conclusions would be – near shook my fillings out.

I think steel is likely much more comfortable; Bretto was crushing it on his Jaeger. I simply called bullshit on the notion that you can't risk a carbon bike or that it would break.

Any material can break on the cobbles; George Hincapie had elected to use an aluminum steerer for the Roubaix to reduce risk of breakage on a carbon steerer. This steerer snapped on the Mons en Pavél secteur.

Also, my Ambrosio Nemesis wheels were much more comfortable on the stones than the Café Roubaix Arenbergs, but as Johan Museeuw pointed out, there are only 50km of cobbles in Roubaix, but 200km of tarmac, so plan accordingly.
frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 9:52 am

@ChrisO

@Daccordi Rider

@Beers

@Daccordi Rider

Train heavy, race light is one of the biggest myths out there. Ever seen a pro jump on a heavy bike to train? Training is simple, effort (watts) and heart rate. You can only push out so many watts or get your heart rate to X. The weight of the bike makes no difference to what your physiology allows you to do and improvements you can make via training properly.

Given a set max heart rate, and a set max wattage, a heavier/less aero bike will have you hitting your ceilings sooner on hills/in wind, and for longer seeing as it is slower over the same distance. What you say is true, if you rode at your maximums for the same length of time on a good bike and a shit bike, your body has done the same amount of work. But when you would be finished on your good bike, you are probably still a fair way away from home when riding the shit bike, because over the distance you are slower. Therefore you spend longer riding at your maximums to get home. More time at max = greater training progression.

You are both totally correct – that’s why the competitive cycling world works on power to weight numbers.

I thought of pointing this out when I read the article but then I thought better of it.

Sometimes Frank likes to write utter bollocks and to intrude on it would be like pointing out the plot holes in Jurassic World. Steel Bikes and Bugno are the cycling equivalent of Raptors and Rexes. Just accept the fantasy.

I read these, you know.
frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 9:59 am

@ChrisO

@Daccordi Rider

ChrisO, I didn’t take that from Fronks article, just calling bullshit on a couple of responses. I thought Frank meant it doesn’t matter what you ride, you get better by hurting yourself. That’s the fun of some of his articles, we can misinterpret them any way we like. People frequently misunderestimate Frank…

Well there’s not much misinterpreting this:

Riding light bikes is fun, but they won’t make you go any faster. Pushing harder on the pedals does

which is quite simply wrong. The same effort on a lighter bike WILL make you go faster. Pushing harder will make you go more faster.

But that would be letting facts get in the way of the story.

Apparently there is misinterpreting it; the bike is not what makes the bike go, fucktard. Pushing on the pedals does; the bike does not have a motor (we hope). I never said you'd go the same speed on a light and heavy bike.

A light bike, or aero bike, or light wheels, or aero wheels, or better tires, or sleeker kit etc will all make it possible to go faster. But they won't actually make you go faster.
frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:03 am

@ErikdR

I’ll probably spend the rest of the day wondering what it means to misunderestimate someone…

If you had spent time living in the US during the Bush Era, you'd know exactly what it means.
Ryan says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:07 am

I recently aquired a new Surly Pacer; a fully 4130 steel frameset set up with Apex. For the last 5 years I have been riding and racing a Cannondale Caad9. The Caad9, set up with 1st gen Sram Red and light Mavic wheels came in at around about 16.5 lbs. My Pacer comes in at 23.2 lbs. I've found myself riding and racing the Pacer exclusively, as the bike fits a tad better (top tube is 5mm shorter) and it is so smooth. It's funny cause the Pacer feels much slower than the Caad9, but my data (strava) shows other wise; the Pacer is consistently faster over every single type and distance of riding. I attribute this to how smooth the bike rides. Riding up chunky pavement? The Pacer, being as smooth as butter, floats over the road imperfections and allows my power to pour out of the rear wheel unadulterated. Ditto on the descents; the steel bike is unaffected but bumps and pot holes in corners. The only disadvantage, and it's rare, is when I'm on a climb going slowly and then have to make a much faster jump to cover an attack. The steel bike does require like one or two extra kicks to wind up the frame, but you really have to be paying attention to notice it. The biggest plus with the steel bike is that at hour four and up, I find myself feeling super fresh, it doesn't feel like someone has been hammering my back, neck and junk.
frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:08 am

@Daccordi Rider

Photo of the year right there.

@wilburrox

61cm < 6kg ? WOW. That’s a lotta C.

Actually, I stand corrected. Its 6.3kg; went and dug up the photo of the scale. Its my VMH's little 51cm R3SL that's well under 6kg, not mine. But the point still stands; its a light fucking bike, and stiff as shit.

@Oli

I think we could settle on approximately 6kg, couldn’t we? Just to give us all some room to move…

The record has been adjusted to reflect this.
Ron says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:14 am

Goddamnit, a lot of needless arguing going on here. The whole point is to balance speed with passion. Marginal gains being mentioned? Fuck that.

It's Friday. I'll commence Recovery Ales in 4 hours, then I'll ride my bike to a party. And, on Sunday, I'm riding in a sleeveless t-shirt.
frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:14 am

@michel02

gert jan theunisse had a training wheel filled with lead, for training purposes needless to say…it worked! (-:

Fucking GJT was such a legend!
frank says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:16 am

@Ron

Goddamnit, a lot of needless arguing going on here. The whole point is to balance speed with passion. Marginal gains being mentioned? Fuck that.

It’s Friday. I’ll commence Recovery Ales in 4 hours, then I’ll ride my bike to a party. And, on Sunday, I’m riding in a sleeveless t-shirt.

Poetry. And also two demerits.
Ron says:

Jun 26 2015 at 10:37 am

Frank - I was trying to make Gianni feel a bit less bad about his previous misbehavior being dragged out for everyone to see. I would never actually wear a sleeveless t-shirt, nor a tank top. With or without a bicycle involved.